How would you define giving rebates? Is that special treatment or just standard business practice?

thanks

I am compelled to respond. First off, the exchanges and SEC are in the business of making money. Motive: since the bear raid in october (massive deleveraging of the financial markets), the exchanges foresaw liquidity crisis brewing. Large and small participants with trillions of dollars lost overnight would be timid to step into the arena without confirmation this time. Vital action by the exchanges was required. Approached by goldman, the idea to artificially create liquidity via HFT program was a great solution catering to institutional volumes while bringing the little guy back into the game. Without these participants the exchanges are inefficient. Can you imagine the MLB only having 5 players per team, you can’t play a game! So, these programs developed by MIT’s finest will front-run, pull, sweep 20 cents on 800 shares, and reload millions of shares to manipulate a stocks value. The outcome you say, large institutions are favored by the exchange filling their large orders with great efficiency, their volume in turn benefits the exchange, real traders who add true liquidity are being hunted by programs that flash bullshit size only to screw them of their money, stir it all together and wallah- is this what you call “empirical insight”. Now that “liquidity” is added and confidence is restored!! What a great sell to the investing public and kudos to the geniuses at GS who are robbing us blind. Its not the playing field, but the game itself is flawed with HFT. These programs have artificial intelligence, its more than insight on a stock bid/ask but they are manipulating price action against real traders. Fundamentals? I have no faith in that anymore.

To that end, for your benefit and everybody else I am going to host Mr. Saluzzi of Themis Trading on my weekly radio show this Sunday evening, August 2nd from 8-9pm.

Here is the link: NoQuarter Radio’s Sense on Cents with Larry Doyle

Hopefully this show will promote a deeper understanding and, in turn, transparency of this topic. I hope you can listen in if not join us by calling in or engaging via the chat room.

Thanks.

I agree with Kevin, I have not seen proof of such a thing, and it would be a terrible scandal if true. Should be easy enough to document.

DDearborn is correct, its a rigged game in that the bog boys have huge edges not available to anyone else.

As for day trader, I’m not sure that pulling and offer AWAY from the inside after the inside is lifted qualifies as manipulation. You should be able to lift the inside and the 102 pence offer simultaneously if you so desire (called a sweep here in the states). If you are saying that can’t be done , and they get to cancel at will, then you have a case.

Zoom out a bit look at the larger picture. Wall Street has always claimed that in general the markets are unpredictable. And that is the reason some people make money and some people lose. However I believe if you look at the trading results of the top firms left on Wallstreet you will see a different picture. Their trading “success” is incredibly high. That is to say they manage to make money on the vast majority of their trades. In a truly random market, with nearly limitless variables this should be impossible over the long haul. And yet day in and day out the likes of Goldman Sachs makes money when everyone else struggles. Th retail investors can’t seem to do much better than break even if they are lucky. Is this “skill”, “luck” or is it insider trading and a rigged market utilizing massive computer power? Hmmm… As they say if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck…….